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What AAD should buy ?


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#1 David C

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 04:45 PM

Morning all, what AAD should I buy ?

I see the two main (cypres and Vigal) at £975 each but the M2 is close to £300 cheaper ??

What does everyone think
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#2 OzzieDave

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Posted 20 August 2016 - 07:22 PM

owned all three, currently own a Vigil 2 and a Mars, happy with both. If I bought a third rig I would have a Cypres. As a working skydiver I will never have 2 reserves/containers or AADs the same as a service bulletin would otherwise ground everything I own. That said Cypres is the last on my list, good product sure I just dislike how they deal with issues. Mars and Vigil have been far more forthcoming with issues and better at getting the solutions to their customers. All companies will f*ck-up; I care about how they deal with it and in my opinion Cypres has failed miserably at this time and time again.


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#3 buzz

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Posted 21 August 2016 - 02:43 PM

owned all three, currently own a Vigil 2 and a Mars, happy with both. If I bought a third rig I would have a Cypres. As a working skydiver I will never have 2 reserves/containers or AADs the same as a service bulletin would otherwise ground everything I own. That said Cypres is the last on my list, good product sure I just dislike how they deal with issues. Mars and Vigil have been far more forthcoming with issues and better at getting the solutions to their customers. All companies will f*ck-up; I care about how they deal with it and in my opinion Cypres has failed miserably at this time and time again.

 

Would you care to expand on the comment about Cypres fialing to deal issues in a suitable manner?

 

I am not a Cypres fan boy, I have 2 vigils, just wondered what you based that on.


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#4 OzzieDave

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Posted 21 August 2016 - 03:42 PM

To clarify I am not anti cypres it's just the one I would purchase last. the biggest example to me is the one listed immediately below:

SB that effected units from between 2009 and 2012: instead of addressing the issue they told users to press the button before EVERY_SINGLE_JUMP and they would deal with it at the service interval (as opposed to other companies who send out parts/recall immediately)

The dual fatality at Z (AFFI and student) - no report or insight despite 2 units failing at the same time...

 

At least 2 friends have had falied units replaced with no explanation given: if I had a unit I fail I am not going to just blindly accept a new one that could be just as faulty without being told why my old one failed and how the new one wont...

From what I have seen when a Cypres have a good product but their customer care is lacking ...


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#5 Donna J

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Posted 22 August 2016 - 12:58 PM

I only own a Cypres 2 and have been more than happy with their service - my cypres got recalled back around 2008, they were open about the fact there was an issue in this case and not only took it away, sorted the issue and returned it promptly, they also covered the cost of the reserve repack.

 

I like that they complete software updates with the service too.  However they are pricey, especially with the FX not being that good at the moment.

 

My other half had a vigil 2, it misfired twice (one on opening, one under canopy) and was sent back for testing, they said they couldn't find anything wrong with it and said it was user error as it was registered as being on Student mode - he had no idea how to change it from experienced mode so that's doubtful, plus given he was on a high performance canopy, completing high performance landing with 50+ jumps between the misfires, being on the wrong mode is either hard to believe, or their student mode doesn't work.  He now has a Cypres 2 as well.

 

As for the MARS, I know they are quite popular in southern Ireland, not so sure about the UK.


Edited by Donna J, 22 August 2016 - 12:58 PM.

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#6 buzz

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Posted 22 August 2016 - 09:08 PM

I only own a Cypres 2 and have been more than happy with their service - my cypres got recalled back around 2008, they were open about the fact there was an issue in this case and not only took it away, sorted the issue and returned it promptly, they also covered the cost of the reserve repack.

 

I like that they complete software updates with the service too.  However they are pricey, especially with the FX not being that good at the moment.

 

My other half had a vigil 2, it misfired twice (one on opening, one under canopy) and was sent back for testing, they said they couldn't find anything wrong with it and said it was user error as it was registered as being on Student mode - he had no idea how to change it from experienced mode so that's doubtful, plus given he was on a high performance canopy, completing high performance landing with 50+ jumps between the misfires, being on the wrong mode is either hard to believe, or their student mode doesn't work.  He now has a Cypres 2 as well.

 

As for the MARS, I know they are quite popular in southern Ireland, not so sure about the UK.

 

If your other half is jumping a HP canopy, making HP landings, and he is not familiar with the operation and limitations of his AAD, he needs to think about what he is doing, or at least get a better coach (if he has a coach), the possibility of an AAD misfire whilst completing a HP landing are very well known (I thought) more than one very experienced jumper has died because of this (at least one on a Cypres, which is why there is a Speed Cypres) and the first thing I discuss with people wanting to start HP landings is equipment compatibility.

 

Granted two missfires in 50 jumps is suspect, but the Vigil works differently to a Cypres and there could be a valid reason for it firing, including exceeding the firing parameters in a turn (this is not a fault with either Cypres or Vigil)

 

I have 23 Vigils, 1 Cypres and touch wood, I havent had an issue with one yet.

 

I don't care which flavour you have, but I highly recommend getting an AAD, only slightly less than I reccommend RTF'ingM so you know what it can and can't do.


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#7 nigelh

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Posted 23 August 2016 - 07:56 AM

I love this question.....


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#8 Donna J

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Posted 23 August 2016 - 01:32 PM

If your other half is jumping a HP canopy, making HP landings, and he is not familiar with the operation and limitations of his AAD, he needs to think about what he is doing, or at least get a better coach (if he has a coach), the possibility of an AAD misfire whilst completing a HP landing are very well known (I thought) more than one very experienced jumper has died because of this (at least one on a Cypres, which is why there is a Speed Cypres) and the first thing I discuss with people wanting to start HP landings is equipment compatibility.

 

Granted two missfires in 50 jumps is suspect, but the Vigil works differently to a Cypres and there could be a valid reason for it firing, including exceeding the firing parameters in a turn (this is not a fault with either Cypres or Vigil)

 

I have 23 Vigils, 1 Cypres and touch wood, I havent had an issue with one yet.

 

I don't care which flavour you have, but I highly recommend getting an AAD, only slightly less than I reccommend RTF'ingM so you know what it can and can't do.

 

Wasn't jumping a high performance canopy Buzz...sorry if that was misconstrued.  


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#9 buzz

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Posted 23 August 2016 - 10:06 PM

Wasn't jumping a high performance canopy Buzz...sorry if that was misconstrued.


My other half had a vigil 2, it misfired twice (one on opening, one under canopy) <snip> </snip>
he had no idea how to change it from experienced mode so that's doubtful, plus given he was on a high performance canopy, completing high performance landing with 50+ jumps between the misfires, being on the wrong mode is either hard to believe,
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#10 Donna J

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Posted 24 August 2016 - 12:49 PM

My error in typing while at work Buzz (I even read my post back and didn't see that part!)... his canopy for the first was a crossfire but that was on canopy opening it misfired, the second (I believe) was on his Sabre 2 as he changed it when he started wingsuiting (He may come on and correct me on that).

 

I was on the second jump and was watching him under canopy, it shouldn't have fired, or it had failed for x amount of jumps before hand if it should...either way, it didn't do it's job properly.

 

Yes he probably should have known how to change the mode of his AAD (now has a non changeable one so he doesn't need to know) but if it was showing on experienced mode when turned on, and wasn't changed at any point by him, it shouldn't be in student mode.

 

Personally, I've always been happy with Cypres, i've no reason to consider any other brand at the moment regardless of price difference, my last resort isn't something i want to be concerned about saving a few quid on.


Edited by Donna J, 24 August 2016 - 12:50 PM.

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#11 nigelh

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Posted 24 August 2016 - 03:21 PM

CYPRES are the best, and if you buy a 2016 model it doesn't need to go for it's routine maintenance (unless you're jumping at a BPA DZ)
 


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#12 Joellercoaster

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Posted 24 August 2016 - 04:23 PM

CYPRES are the best


Are you trying to help, or just trolling? Why is it the best, Nigel? Give the OP the benefit of your (considerable) experience.
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#13 buzz

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Posted 24 August 2016 - 04:35 PM

CYPRES are the best, and if you buy a 2016 model it doesn't need to go for it's routine maintenance (unless you're jumping at a BPA DZ)


Ha ha, you may or may not be correct, however the opinion of a sponsored jumper is diminished by said sponsorship :-)

I must admit that the way Airtech have handled the maintenance issue feels a little suspect, even if it is above board. I'll give them the BoD and put it down to a language difference.
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#14 Lloyd Quenby

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Posted 24 August 2016 - 06:40 PM

I have never seen the point in a user changeable firing mode

 

If it was on the unit itself that could only be changed by opening the reserve then fine but there is no need for the user to be able to change to or from

tandem mode. If its in student kit then anyone jumping it would more than likely be low experience so student mode would probably be a good thing.

 

The only mode i can see of benefit is swoop to experience, apart from that i see no benefit, especially considering that on a cypres the only indicator is a tiny black dot so is just asking for trouble.


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#15 nigelh

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Posted 25 August 2016 - 12:12 AM

Hey I'm sponsored to promote them!

Lloyd, "For Example" You own 1 tandem, 2 sport rigs and 2 student rigs, your Tandem is due a maintenance, you're doing lots of tandems, but not much AFF at the time....
You switch one to the tandem and keep jumping! 


Edited by nigelh, 25 August 2016 - 12:13 AM.

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#16 Lloyd Quenby

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Posted 25 August 2016 - 06:54 AM

which is why i said it should only be changeable on the unit in the reserve


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#17 buzz

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Posted 25 August 2016 - 06:57 PM

which is why i said it should only be changeable on the unit in the reserve

:whistle:


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#18 David C

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Posted 27 August 2016 - 04:40 PM

Gents, lots of comments thank you.

But I am no closer to what to get lol

I think I will get a M2 (they are cheaper)
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#19 Lloyd Quenby

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Posted 27 August 2016 - 05:06 PM

A few years ago i would have said cypres without hesitation, but now i feel that vigil has become a mature product and would be happy to use either a cypres or vigil.

 

I have no experience of other units.


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#20 nigelh

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Posted 29 August 2016 - 08:06 AM

Gents, lots of comments thank you.

But I am no closer to what to get lol

I think I will get a M2 (they are cheaper)

I said buy a CYPRES2, 25 years of experience, industry leaders, there's no argument ;) 
 


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